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Alfa164Diagnostics

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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Alfan » Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:31 pm

You're welcome :)

I actually thought it was menitoned in this thread, but using different fora, sometimes you overlook where you saw the info.
1994 Alfa Romeo 164 Q4 Proteo Rosso 535.000km
1989 Lancia Thema 8.32 Verde Indy 260.000km
2015 Alfa Romeo 4C Rosso Competizione 75.000km
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby pinino » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:11 pm

One's eyes glaze over after a point! I've seen many references to the pigtail version with male connector but not the female with latch. Now I can make a dandy extension cord. Do you think the cord needs to of the shielded type? The reason I ask is that the original cables that come with the FL Tester are shielded. On a side note, I have 4 original cables, 3 do not use the middle pin of the 3-pin connector, while 1 has it connected to pin 8 of the 9-pin sub D. How are yours?
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Alfan » Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:49 pm

pinino wrote:One's eyes glaze over after a point! I've seen many references to the pigtail version with male connector but not the female with latch. Now I can make a dandy extension cord. Do you think the cord needs to of the shielded type? The reason I ask is that the original cables that come with the FL Tester are shielded. On a side note, I have 4 original cables, 3 do not use the middle pin of the 3-pin connector, while 1 has it connected to pin 8 of the 9-pin sub D. How are yours?


That's a good question, if needed or not. I haven't looked that specifically at the cables, but will do so in the next couple of days and get back to you. I have also bought another Marelli tester, which I should get next week. I don't know how many cables will come with that, but will also look at that.
1994 Alfa Romeo 164 Q4 Proteo Rosso 535.000km
1989 Lancia Thema 8.32 Verde Indy 260.000km
2015 Alfa Romeo 4C Rosso Competizione 75.000km
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby pinino » Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:19 pm

... I forgot to say that I fabricated a set of cables using non-shielded wire and they seem to work fine. I imagine that the original cables are a bit overkill.
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Alfan » Fri Feb 14, 2014 7:44 pm

I have put photos here of the diagnostic plug for the tester and the plugs in the car for the 4WD and Motronic, you can see them here:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/h55vl8khj7e72x0/uftqSGvx4W

In the tester side with the 3 pin plug, the black wire is cut, but I have no problem using it. I can see that the 3 wires are shielded in the surrounding cable. I will look at the cable(s) in the tester I will get next week.

From what I can see, the wires going to the units in the car are not shielded.
1994 Alfa Romeo 164 Q4 Proteo Rosso 535.000km
1989 Lancia Thema 8.32 Verde Indy 260.000km
2015 Alfa Romeo 4C Rosso Competizione 75.000km
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Maffia_Alfista » Sun Feb 16, 2014 4:38 pm

I have tried to connect to the ABS and Motronic-ECU but they don't seem to respond.

With the Alfa164Diagnostics program this is what happends

* Connect the 3-pin plug to the ECU I want to check
* Connect the crocodile clamps to power and ground --> Green light in program lights up
* Turn on ignition
* Clicks connect and the Yellow light starts flashing but the Green light turns off.
* The program status shows Connecting ECU but nothing happens..

I guess that the green light should stay on all the time but it doesn't..

I have tried different grounds and power sources but no difference
I have also tried the Multiecuscan program but it just says "ECU not responding" after trying to connect for a while..

Any ideas?
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Alfan » Sun Feb 16, 2014 6:46 pm

Maffia_Alfista wrote:I have tried to connect to the ABS and Motronic-ECU but they don't seem to respond.

With the Alfa164Diagnostics program this is what happends

* Connect the 3-pin plug to the ECU I want to check
* Connect the crocodile clamps to power and ground --> Green light in program lights up
* Turn on ignition
* Clicks connect and the Yellow light starts flashing but the Green light turns off.
* The program status shows Connecting ECU but nothing happens..

I guess that the green light should stay on all the time but it doesn't..

I have tried different grounds and power sources but no difference
I have also tried the Multiecuscan program but it just says "ECU not responding" after trying to connect for a while..

Any ideas?


I think your order is wrong, but as I have just had to change to a summer tire because of a flat, I might have missed something in your description...

- Connect all the physical parts, so you got 12V supply for the clamps. Red light on the connector should be on (maybe you have a different type of HW, so not sure)
- Start Wilco's program (I assume you got a port connected, since you have green light)
- Turn on ignition
- Then press 'Connect' to the unit you are hooked up to

That should give you a green light and connection, possibly with the yellow light flashing some times. You could also try the airbag to see if that works. That is to the right side of the glovebox behind the plastic trim.
1994 Alfa Romeo 164 Q4 Proteo Rosso 535.000km
1989 Lancia Thema 8.32 Verde Indy 260.000km
2015 Alfa Romeo 4C Rosso Competizione 75.000km
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Maffia_Alfista » Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:24 pm

Alfan wrote:
Maffia_Alfista wrote:I have tried to connect to the ABS and Motronic-ECU but they don't seem to respond.

With the Alfa164Diagnostics program this is what happends

* Connect the 3-pin plug to the ECU I want to check
* Connect the crocodile clamps to power and ground --> Green light in program lights up
* Turn on ignition
* Clicks connect and the Yellow light starts flashing but the Green light turns off.
* The program status shows Connecting ECU but nothing happens..

I guess that the green light should stay on all the time but it doesn't..

I have tried different grounds and power sources but no difference
I have also tried the Multiecuscan program but it just says "ECU not responding" after trying to connect for a while..

Any ideas?


I think your order is wrong, but as I have just had to change to a summer tire because of a flat, I might have missed something in your description...

- Connect all the physical parts, so you got 12V supply for the clamps. Red light on the connector should be on (maybe you have a different type of HW, so not sure)
- Start Wilco's program (I assume you got a port connected, since you have green light)
- Turn on ignition
- Then press 'Connect' to the unit you are hooked up to

That should give you a green light and connection, possibly with the yellow light flashing some times. You could also try the airbag to see if that works. That is to the right side of the glovebox behind the plastic trim.


Yeah that's what I have tried.
Light on the connector is on.
Green and Red lights in program on but turns off then I try to connect and the yellow light starts flashing.
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Alfan » Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:54 pm

Maffia_Alfista wrote:Yeah that's what I have tried.
Light on the connector is on.
Green and Red lights in program on but turns off then I try to connect and the yellow light starts flashing.


The green light is not on, until I have pressed connect, so it seems you have different behaviour...

Wilco....?
1994 Alfa Romeo 164 Q4 Proteo Rosso 535.000km
1989 Lancia Thema 8.32 Verde Indy 260.000km
2015 Alfa Romeo 4C Rosso Competizione 75.000km
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Maffia_Alfista » Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:27 pm

Alfan wrote:
Maffia_Alfista wrote:Yeah that's what I have tried.
Light on the connector is on.
Green and Red lights in program on but turns off then I try to connect and the yellow light starts flashing.


The green light is not on, until I have pressed connect, so it seems you have different behaviour...

Wilco....?


Well that's strange... I will try again later and take pictrures

The .ini drive install file didn't work at first but when I connected the VAG-COM Windows found new USB-hardware and I chose to search for drives in the folder where I had put the Wilco-drivefiles.

Windows installed 2 drives and after that the diagnostics program found the VAG-COM and was able to connect through Port 1.
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby wilco » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:53 am

well.. the yellow light shows the connection request.
the green lights on received data
The red lights on sending data.
So it might the ecu is not responding.
Also set the buffers and responsetime for the port as low as possible.
What hardware do you use ? (PC)
Henry Ford, 1939: "Every time I see an Alfa Romeo pass by, I lift my hat."
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby ppg » Thu May 01, 2014 5:36 am

Thanks for making and sharing this excellent program with all of us!! :D
I be able to connect perfectly with the Engine ECU and ABS of my 1997 24v, but I have one cuestion (it is very stupid, but it is driving me really crazy). How many cables are supposed to have the 3 pin test connector for a Siemens Airbag Module? I found it near to the glovebox, but it only have 2 cables on it (White/red and black) but I suppose it must have 3 cables on it, like the ones of the ecu and ABS. Is it right? What colours are they? I am trying to turn off my annoying airbag light that show up a few days ago :( Thanks in advance!!
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Alfamuppet » Thu May 01, 2014 9:04 pm

Wilco

Many thanks for your program, I have had several issues with the running of my Q4, with rough idle when hot to non starting when cold.

This week spent two hours trying to start the car, succeeded and then she would not start again. I plugged in your software and a RPM sensor was the fault code displayed. I replaced this and bingo she started first time and has run the smoothest ever since I bought her.

I can't thank you enough for saving me hours of manual diagnostics

Thanks Daryl
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby 164 TD » Fri May 02, 2014 5:13 am

ppg wrote:Thanks for making and sharing this excellent program with all of us!! :D
I be able to connect perfectly with the Engine ECU and ABS of my 1997 24v, but I have one cuestion (it is very stupid, but it is driving me really crazy). How many cables are supposed to have the 3 pin test connector for a Siemens Airbag Module? I found it near to the glovebox, but it only have 2 cables on it (White/red and black) but I suppose it must have 3 cables on it, like the ones of the ecu and ABS. Is it right? What colours are they? I am trying to turn off my annoying airbag light that show up a few days ago :( Thanks in advance!!


If it has never been touched before, the airbagconnector is located behind the trimpanel right of the glovecompartment.The trimpanel has only one screw and slides down after the screw is loose. Behind the panel you will find the righthand connectorfield which connects the dashboard to the rest of the car. The connectors are on a kind of sled. You can pull the sled out and if you look around with a flashlight you will see your 3 pin ABS connector.

Disregard the circle, that circle was for another topic. This is the area where the ABS connector should be located.

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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby ppg » Fri May 02, 2014 6:35 pm

Thank you for your response 164TD! I sadly guess the connector has been touched before, but the airbag light worked fine until a couple of days ago. I send you a few pictures of the connector (that as you can see has only 2 cables on it), and the airbag module. I saw all the connectors diagrams in the manual section of the forum (very helpful by the way) and the airbag should have 3 cables on it (White red, black and light blue White), but mine has only 2 :( I suppose that´s the reason because I can´t communicate with the Ecu, but I didn´t find any loose cable. This version is the latest one, with double airbag, maybe that´s the reason of this difference, can it be possible?

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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby 164 TD » Fri May 02, 2014 8:24 pm

This is the last version of the airbags

The diagnostic connector indeed only has 2 pins.black is ground; diagnostic K an L line go over the other wire.

I cannot find it instanly but Wilco solved this mistery by using another program of another Airbagsystem. Use the searchfuntion on the forum for it.
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby wilco » Fri May 02, 2014 9:10 pm

Hi there all..
I'm sorry for not beeing around so much.. i'll try to be more around.. so ask :D

the new type airbag is the allied signal airbag. at some point i will also integrate this one into the program and i did start it, but due to lack of time.. i just didn't finish it..
what you can do..
Find FiatEcuScan_3.6.0.
Then use Fiat Marea '99 Allied Signal Airbag (1F) or any type (alfa 156 will do too) with the Allied Signal Airbag (1F)
This one is able to reset the newer type airbag.
Henry Ford, 1939: "Every time I see an Alfa Romeo pass by, I lift my hat."
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby wilco » Fri May 02, 2014 9:18 pm

Alfan wrote:
Maffia_Alfista wrote:Yeah that's what I have tried.
Light on the connector is on.
Green and Red lights in program on but turns off then I try to connect and the yellow light starts flashing.


The green light is not on, until I have pressed connect, so it seems you have different behaviour...

Wilco....?

the yellow light is initialisation. (the program sends)
The green light is received data from the car
the red light is sent data to the car.

Does it get the serial number of the ECU?
If yes, do both the red and green flicker for some time ?
Henry Ford, 1939: "Every time I see an Alfa Romeo pass by, I lift my hat."
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby wilco » Fri May 02, 2014 9:20 pm

the question about shielded or not. The speed of the protocol is only 4800 baud. which is pretty slow.
I have seen original testers with 3 meters unshielded wire so i guess it should go just fine.
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby ppg » Sun May 04, 2014 6:14 am

Thanks 164TD and Wilco, you guys are awesome! :D I downloaded the MultiEcuScan and now I can communicate with the Airbag Ecu using the Allied Signal 1F. Then I got two error codes: 02 - Battery Voltage too low and 10 - Passenger's squib in S.C.
When I cleared the error codes, the second one only appears after a while again. Do you know if there is a connector that I can check? Thanks again for your help!!!
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby 164 TD » Sun May 04, 2014 3:46 pm

SC means Short Circuit.

I'm on holidays for a week, I will scan the whereabouts of the last series airbag when I'm back home...
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby ppg » Sun May 04, 2014 6:50 pm

Thanks 164TD!! Have a good holiday! :wink:
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby wilco » Sun May 04, 2014 10:19 pm

the airbag ecu is in the mid console close to the engine ecu.
You can check the yellow cable under the dashboard passenger side going up to the airbag itself.. maybe someone did "bridge" it so it's not in use with a little kid on the frontseat.. just a wild guess.. but since its shortcut...
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby Grilzz » Thu Aug 07, 2014 7:05 am

I have a USB VAGKKL+FIATECUSCAN cable with a switch to switch between pins 7,3,1/9,12/13 and a additional 3pin converter with two clamps for the power supply. Will that one work?

I was unable to connect to the ECU with MultiEcuScan and have read that that software does not support my car.
It's a 164 3.0 V6 24v Super 1995.

Is there maybe a video on how somebody set up the connection with Alfa164Diagnostics?

Thanks for the help!
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Re: Alfa164Diagnostics

Postby 164 TD » Fri Aug 08, 2014 2:26 pm

This cables should work.

Did the cable come with a CD; on the CD you will have the drivers.
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